Richard Dreyfuss on Firing Line with Margaret Hoover
Oscar winner Richard Dreyfuss discusses America’s civics crisis and his initiative to restore civics education in public schools.
HOOVER: Shifting gears entirely, starting in 2024, films will be required to meet new inclusion standards to be eligible for the Academy Awards for best picture. They’ll have to have a certain percentage of actors or crew from underrepresented racial and ethnic groups. What do you think of these new inclusion standards for films?
DREYFUSS: They make me vomit.
HOOVER: Why?
DREYFUSS: Because this is an art form. It’s also a form of commerce, and it makes money. But it’s an art. And no one should be telling me as an artist that I have to give in to the latest, most current idea of what morality is. And what are we risking? Are we really risking hurting people’s feelings? You can’t legislate that. And– you have to let life be life. And I’m sorry, I don’t think that there is a minority or a majority in the country that has to be catered to like that. You know, Laurence Olivier was the last white actor to play Othello, and he did it in 1965. And he did it in blackface.And he played a black man brilliantly. Am I being told that I will never have a chance to play a black man? Is someone else being told that if they’re not Jewish, they shouldn’t play the Merchant of Venice? Are we crazy? Do we not know that art is art? This is so patronizing. It’s so thoughtless, and treating people like children.
HOOVER: Do you think there’s a difference between the question of representation and who is allowed to represent other groups. For example, as you said, somebody representing the Merchant of Venice, and the case of blackface explicitly in this country given the history of slavery and the sensitivities around Black racism. Do you think there’s a difference between those?
DREYFUSS: There shouldn’t be.
HOOVER: Why?
DREYFUSS: Because it’s patronizing. Because it says that we’re so fragile that we don’t can’t have our our feelings hurt. We have to anticipate having our feelings hurt, our children’s feelings. We don’t know how to stand up and bop the bully in the face.
HOOVER: Do you think as we tell stories about our past. Do agree that there is a fuller version of our history that is perhaps more inclusive to the diversity of the country now, or–
DREYFUSS: You know I once worked for a guy who was making a film about the gangsters of the thirties. And he– I said, why did you change this incident and that incident from the reality? Because the reality was so much more interesting than what you created. And by changing it you made it simple and smaller. And I totally believe that you can make a great film or a great painting or a great opera out of the truth first. And try that first. And then if you can’t do it, then make up some nonsense. But don’t– don’t tell me you can’t do that, that history isn’t that interesting.
Clayton is the founder and publisher of the social and political commentary newsletter Think Things Through and the host of the Think Things Through Podcast.
Twitter: @claytoncraddock